🎙️ Just2Us! 😄🎧

The Heart and Soul of Self-Publishing Poetry

• Zachery Williams • Season 3 • Episode 12

Share episode

What happens when you blend cultural heritage, a love for poetry, and the struggles of self-publishing? On this heartening episode of Just the Two of Us with Mr. Zach Attack, we sit down with the remarkable poet, author, and entrepreneur Abby. She takes us on an emotional journey from her roots in Colorado to her new life in Alabama, shedding light on the social and cultural shifts that have shaped her. Growing up, writing became Abby’s sanctuary, offering a vital means of self-expression during her shy childhood. You'll hear about how her Native American heritage influences her relationship with food and the bittersweet memories tied to her upbringing.

Storytelling in poetry isn't just about words on a page; it's a living, breathing experience. Together, Abby and I explore the delicate balance of providing backstory versus letting the audience interpret poetry on their own terms. With insights from various poetry communities, including the Poetry Unfold in New Jersey, we discuss the pressures poets face and the joy derived from creating poetry for personal and communal satisfaction. Abby shares her vision for making a name in the local poetry scene, remaining authentic in her craft, and the fulfillment that comes from poetry as an art rather than a business.

Ever wondered about the emotional toil of self-publishing? Abby opens up about the painstaking process, from proofreading to dealing with criticism, all while staying true to her voice. We delve into the importance of professional biographies and personal storytelling, and Abby reveals her rigorous networking efforts to make meaningful connections in the poetry community. To cap it off, Abby performs a heartfelt poetry piece on growth and mutual support in relationships. Her parting message on self-care and kindness underscores the episode, leaving us all inspired to be a little gentler with ourselves. Don’t miss this episode packed with heartfelt stories, poetic wisdom, and empowering messages.

Send us a text

Speaker 1:

Hey you guys, welcome to Just the Two of Us. It is your broadcast host.

Speaker 2:

Mr Zach. So I want you to relax, put your feet up, grab you a glass of wine and a snack, Cause you are tuning into my broadcast. See you later.

Speaker 1:

Welcome to Just the Two of Us broadcast. It is your favorite host, mr Zach Attack, on his one cent two. I hope y'all are doing today because I am doing excellent. I am doing excellent, I am doing well. You know we don't take no L's over here I am sitting with my good friend, our poet, our author, an entrepreneur, everything in between. Let's get up to my girl Abby.

Speaker 3:

What's up, abby, how you doing, thank you. Thank you for that lovely introduction.

Speaker 1:

You're welcome. How you doing today, girl? Good, beating this, beating this, what 115 heat? Oh gosh, tell me about it. Tell me, tell me about it, girl. We be hot over here. It was hot, so I'd like to ask everybody who's always on my broadcast and not my guests how is your mental health doing?

Speaker 3:

oh, that's a great question. It's honestly gotten so much better. Consistency is the key. My meditation routine being patient with things and myself, eating right, exercising, you know, hanging out with the right people doing productive things.

Speaker 1:

That part. And getting sleep you need your sleep. You need your sleep. I'm telling you you need your sleep. So let's talk about who is abby. Where is abby born from? Like? When people ask you that question, what's the first thing that comes to your mind? Like introduce yourself. Give us a background on yourself.

Speaker 3:

History lessons well, no one's ever really asked me who I am, um, but I was originally born in colorado and I spent, like probably the first six years of my life, I want to say um, and then we had to move to alabama, so that was a huge culture and that I think I'm still getting PTSD from that move.

Speaker 3:

Why is that? Flying insects? The environment, culturally, socially, that's been hard because when you go to a place like colorado not saying it's perfect, there's no perfect place in the world but, um, there just wasn't this sense of like separation between classes, at least in my perspective, and even when I've gone to visit, there's not like a huge heavy weight on this areas where these down and this area, you know you can, you could see, like where the money draws the line or and that sort of thing. So it's granted, there are, there is a line in in there, but in colorado, but you know, overall, most people you know they love the outdoors, they're there for a reason, like there's, there's the only sports state I've seen where they like sport, their own gear, like colorado people with a year, like all the time.

Speaker 3:

It's a beautiful state, um, you know it's not for everybody, but the mountains are, it's great. I'm really grateful that I had that somewhat of an upbringing because, like I didn't have fast food until I moved to Alabama, never had. Grandma came on, you know, and she was like this is what makes a sandwich, you know, here's kitty, here's Burger King, here's whatever. But I didn't grow up with a house full of food. My mom always cooked till a certain point and we had a garden back then. We ate fresh food and I remember roasting corn. My dad would roast corn on the grill and so coming here.

Speaker 3:

Um, so when people say like, oh, I have nothing to eat, but they have a cabinet full of food, like it doesn't make sense to me, like I'm like this sounds like a very American thing to say yeah. So for me I work a lot less. Like grocery stores for a long time gave me anxiety and that was something I worked on with my therapist and I wasn't sure if that was the cause. But really I struggle with eating because my dad was native american. So, um, yeah, certain foods like I can't I struggle with on that level, but I love to cook and the less I have to work with, the more I can make and I know that sounds weird, but I, I love it and I can get really creative in the zone in the kitchen.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so she said she could cook. A girl, she said she could cook.

Speaker 2:

She could cook a good meal. So dang it.

Speaker 1:

So go ahead.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, so, getting back on track to your question, I found out I was a really timid kid, very shy, um, and writing was like a way for me to. I didn't realize it then, but writing was a way for me to kind of express myself. Um, and when you're like a dorky kid with glasses and you know like you have pigtails and you wear timberlands to school, like it looks weird and like you know, like you don't talk a lot, you know it can get a little, and then the one time you try to talk and make a joke, it sounds really awkward so you just stop talking. Yeah, I would always get in trouble for writing upside down, writing writing sideways, being, um, being different, yeah, being ambidextrous, like with, with, yeah, and I just it would. Some teachers would embrace it. Most of them were like you need to do it this way, um, but I didn't realize how much writing affected me until I was about 12 years old and I realized, like this is, this is just something I have to do every day journaling.

Speaker 1:

All right, since you're an open adult in writing. Those who know Abby. Abby is a writer. She is definitely one of my role models that I look up to in poetry. You know different ways how to write, different skills, different how to use on, different words and rhymes and free verses.

Speaker 3:

So how did you get into poetry, as you want to call it? I think it found me, honestly, when I was invited to an open mic, a free verse, open mic actually in 2022, 2022, may of 2022, and I didn't think anything of it. I was like that's just words. I'm gonna go. First, I'm a little nervous, so I have my little paragraph and I'm like, and then and I leave and I'm like, oh, that's fun, you know. And then I sit back and I listen to everybody else and I'm like I had no idea what I got myself into. Like they're talking about trauma. They're talking about like um, they're talking about like what? Oh my God, zinnia did her like piece about men, but it's really about bagels.

Speaker 1:

Yes, yeah, I do remember that.

Speaker 3:

Yes, not being as smart as this late. Yes, I was like this is some talent right here. And then that was the first night I met Chris, chris Nguyen and Mar here. And then that was the first night I met chris um, chris win and um mara and, like so many other people, the first time I met marcus amaker and, like, I literally been emailing him for five years but never met in person, um, so it was really a unique experience and I think something came out of me from that, because the next month, the next time we had an open mic, things were just pouring out of me. I almost got really upset because I couldn't make it stop, you know.

Speaker 3:

You have a gift. Yeah, yeah, we all do. I mean, it's incredible to watch us all grow and see how far we come.

Speaker 1:

Oh gosh, Just oh gosh. Just to look back at it now and to see how we grow in our writing skill and in different ways, how we took it off in different directions, it still blows my mind today like you would never tell me that I would get it from the mic and spit some real ass shit.

Speaker 3:

but you know you're so confident about it.

Speaker 1:

Girl, I tell you I be nervous. I tell people, every time you hit the mic I am nervous and like, I tell people like, oh, you a pro at this? No, I'm not. No, I'm not. I take it day by day. Someone's got this mic. I don't know who I am.

Speaker 3:

It's challenging, though, because it brings out a different side of us. And then, even now, what is it, two years later?

Speaker 2:

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 3:

Performing and we've performed in different platforms and different cities. So it's still a little note-wracking because you're being vulnerable, you know, and it's a different side of people to get to know you. So when people saw me, there's a whole different part of Charleston and our life. Really that doesn't know me from poetry. They know me before poetry and they're like who is this person? Like it's hard for a lot of people to comprehend. I'll be honest, like it was and I was like this is me and they're like no, it's not, I'm like, it's me I said this is me.

Speaker 1:

This is a new version of me we're supposed to evolve right and change exactly so you, you open up another door of being nervous and anxious, stepping out of your comfort zone. So, when you've been out there the first time, what was going through your head, as you have plenty of people watching you, and what advice can you give somebody who's their first time on the mic?

Speaker 3:

even if you're nervous, just do it. If you mess up, don't say sorry, just keep going. Like I could see that a lot, like I hear it a lot. Like sorry, like no girl, keep, keep going. And you know, finish up and don't. But also don't press yourself. If you don't want to do it, like don't do it.

Speaker 3:

You know no one's forcing you to come and share your story. It's it's really up to you, um, and I think that's what I like about it. It's like we, there's really no judgment, no pressure, um, you could say what speaks to your mind, um, but also kind of scale back on some of the storytelling, because there doesn't always need to be a title, we don't always need to know, like, the whole backstory, um, because we have such an allotted time up there, right. So it's like you know we got to give other people space and time and, yes, it's exciting, thrilling, and you know you want people to connect with you, but I, for me, like my words speak for themselves. You know, if there needs to be a backstory, and I might speak it, but try to reel that in just a little bit too so why do you think a lot of people like give a lot of backstory or just let their poem speak for itself?

Speaker 1:

because sometimes when you hear poetry it speak for the speak for the whole entire story, like you don't even have to tell a background story.

Speaker 3:

Oh, exactly Same with musicians too, I think. One, they're nervous. Two, they really just want to make that connection with people at the end of the day, and they think this is what they need to do, to do it Really. If we're intently listening, we'll hear it. And one of the cool things I got to experience in New Jersey was a group called the Poetry Unfold and a wonderful community. And so you get one poem and you go up, you do your piece. You don't say you just like this is my piece and you say it, and after your piece they give like a couple minutes, they'll have a Q&A, and so people, you get immediate feedback on your piece and it's rewarding because you don't.

Speaker 1:

A lot of times we don't know people are listening right exactly until they come up to you and they start listening to you and at the end and they give you feedback and you'd be like why don't your mind? Be like, oh, you got that out of that, and like what for?

Speaker 3:

real. It's wild because it's like, and then you know you probably got the same experience when you published. People have a very different perception of your pieces than you would, and it's kind of cool to get that. You know lens from other people and I think that's what makes poetry so unique. It's not like any other form of writing where it's already set in stone, give people a window into your life and I guess even like songs. You know people can interpret it how they will and it's cool to get that feedback, good and bad.

Speaker 1:

So, as I still have platforms now in the poetry world, do you think it's a lot more pressure on us to perform or to give good pieces out of? People are expecting us to do certain pieces.

Speaker 3:

I'll be like it could do better or give their opinions on it um, I will say everybody wants me to do divine tea and I love that piece.

Speaker 3:

It really defines me, but it I'm like I don't want to do it every time. Um, I'll do it for a newer audience, I guess, but I guess I've. I've come, I've seen, I've seen new york city, like I've seen jersey city, I've seen charlotte, you know, I've seen, um, the kind of ladder that people are, especially in philly too, like the ladder that people are chasing for poetry, scares me because it reminds me a lot of when I worked in the entertainment industry, the music industry. So everyone is just chasing that level to be the next thing and and some of them are really humble I'm not saying they're all like this, but it's like it's exhausting to go from gig to gig to gig and try to be genuine, because you're literally marcus, put us a really good way like you're throwing up on stage and people want to come up and talk to you about it and you don't have time to like decompress and take it um and I kind of sort of did a mini tour up there.

Speaker 3:

It was very spontaneous, it was like Jersey City, Manhattan and Philly and I was so exhausted, it was like a week of things and it was just. It was so physically and emotionally draining that I didn't know if, like this is what I wanted to do, because I was on the performance side versus working behind the stage and it's a very um, but I don't now.

Speaker 3:

I don't. I don't ever think about like when's the next piece gonna come, like it's so natural for me. I don't even think about it. I don't even think about like when's a new piece gonna form, it going to come on its own time, where you're going to go back to an older piece or go back to a journal or resonated with you years ago and you can just make something new out of it.

Speaker 3:

So I never worry about that. Um, but I I wouldn't treat poetry. Poetry should not be like this form of entertainment in the sense of um, you know, in the way that entertainment news is, or in the way like the entertainment industry is like there's no need to monetize it. In that sense, we want to get paid, we want to get recognized for what we do, and I'm grateful for when we do, but it's not something that needs to be, uh, um, commercialized. Let's put it that way.

Speaker 1:

And I think, just to add on top of that, I think for, like, just for my experience, I think the number one goal for me is to be a house no name in Charleston. So that's not for me to like get paid or stuff like that, cause I love doing poetry. Poetry is a passion. Poetry is something that I love to vent out or show people who I am, another side of me that they don't know. And like you hear people, it's a competition. Like you got to do better than this one, you got to do better than that one you got to do. Like you got to do this, you got to do that. I'm like, well, well, you really don't only you. You have to stick out from the rest, right, because each for each poetry or each people who does poetry is have different styles exactly.

Speaker 3:

we each have our own voice and when someone asked me in a workshop, like, how do I get started? And I was like or you know, yes, connect with people and open mics, but you've got to find your voice first. Don't try to mimic anybody. It's good to know new skills, but if you try to write like somebody else or sound like somebody else, you're not being authentic. That's not the point of poetry.

Speaker 1:

And to add on top of that I agree with what you're saying. And to add on top of that I agree with what you're saying, and having your own voice and being different and not sound like everybody's the same way, because eventually people are going to tune out. If everybody sounds the same way, people are going to tune out and they'll be like another one, like this person, another one like that person. So for me, I always like switch it out because I don't want to sound like the next person and I don't want to like everybody goes to something differently throughout life, but like also stay essentially you and your writing piece and people will know you as that, instead of sounding like oh, point A, point B, oh, she's just another one that sounded like point A.

Speaker 3:

And that's what I love about the community that we do have is we're so unique, and when I get the opportunity to collaborate with you guys, we create a whole new voice. As Natasha Acri put it, you're creating a third voice at that point, but also we're embracing who we are. But also like we're embracing who we are, and it's cool, because the way I write, the way you write, the way Chris writes, the way Marcus writes, is incredible, because someone on some, it's more humbling to just stay who you are and see what opportunities are, and that was the one thing I I wanted was to publish. Yes, absolutely, but it's the opportunities that come because of it. It wasn't for the money, like I was, like I'm not gonna make money off this. It was opportunities that come.

Speaker 1:

I said off my first one. That's why I say opportunity comes. So, speaking of that first book, so let the listeners know what is your first book called, how you got started, what are some challenges during writing the book, what were some of the good moments during the process of forming that book and what do you want next after that.

Speaker 3:

So the first book I wrote was called Between Words and it was always those two. That term was always in my journals at some point on different levels of my life. It seemed very natural and there's like a three-piece. So there's between words one, two and three that are in the book and it's chapters of my life that are kind of going through, and the third one, well, the first one's about a former partner. Second one's about my relationship with my mother and the third one is about me no longer putting myself in that box, taking myself out of that chapter, but really it was mostly journal entries. It was like a slew of things, of experiences, pieces that needed a home, even the newer experiences that I created here in charleston or new york, and it's very reflective of that.

Speaker 3:

I think the hardest, the most challenging part about publishing, self-publishing, um, was the proofreading. Like I think I did it and it was like when you're on your third proof and you realize autocorrect somehow took over, now you have to upload the manuscript for the five time time and I was like, so I just like I'm so over this, like I'm so oh, like I was just getting so pissed off and like it'll be like one word, just one letter off, and you're like, is it even worth it? You guys still get the message right. Um, but I learned such a valuable skill and through that frustration, like a lot of tears, like I cried one I was like I want to do this. Um, I want to learn this. Damn, I'm gonna learn this. Damn it, I'm going to learn this.

Speaker 3:

Two I was hesitant because it's not the. There's a lot of dark pieces in there and I wanted to be respectful of the people that affected me in that way, particularly family, and they didn't really take it very well. I kind of just had to be like you know what? Forget about that. This is my canvas, not to put anyone down, this is just how we interpret what we experience, right. Um, I guess that would be. The second part of this thing was the the negative feedback I got after publishing. I got a lot of support from friends and mentors, but when it came to like family, it was now, they're like cool about it. They're like, oh, look at you, you know, I know someone famous, you know like, that's what it's like now. But when it first came out, they were like oh, that's what you think about us.

Speaker 1:

That's not what I said. You know I didn't point of. You know they were like oh, that's what you think about us Like a flat eye.

Speaker 3:

That's not what I said. You know I didn't point, you know. So it was hard, but and certain people took it very hard and that was that was hard to swallow. But I'm really grateful because every time I went to go back and reread all the poems that I had, I was like, no, that's exactly what I'm going to say, I don't want to change anything, um. And so just being confident in that, in your ability to say your piece, um, and be strong about it, there we go and I think to relate to you.

Speaker 1:

well, I haven't got, I haven't gotten the like the the negative yet, cause I think the second one is going to be a lot of negative.

Speaker 3:

Are you saying, like you should publish after you're gone from this universe?

Speaker 1:

Yo every book we're like fuck all that shit. Yo every book we're like fuck all that shit. No, I think, like I tell people like, just like you are your canvas.

Speaker 1:

Like you have to fuck everything else and just do you. I'm going to just say it like that, because a lot of people don't realize. When you're reading something, you have to think about that person as they're at that time and at that moment, yeah, you might feel some type of way about this, but it's not your experience. You can relate to it in, in, in, in a different way, but at that same point, that is her experience, that is her moment in a point of life.

Speaker 3:

That's how she felt that moment was my favorite one was this guy, um, who was mr like. Um, emotions don't matter, like you know, I don't give a f what people think about me, yada, yada. So there was, there was something in there in one of the pieces that related to our conversation that we had, and he was like, he got so offended and I'm like you, of all people, I remember this, oh, my God, mr Businessman, mr Like, yeah, oh yeah, cause, yes, he, he said quit hanging out with poets and poor people and I use that for my piece and I'm like I'm gonna run with this. And he got really offended and I was, I was shocked, I was like it was good.

Speaker 1:

I got it by itself.

Speaker 3:

It's a poetry staple, let me tell you. Um, you know, but also coming out of that transition like it's a whole different part of my life now, just which is crazy to think about, because it just it was, seems.

Speaker 3:

So the next manuscript I'm working on, which just kind of popped out of nowhere, um, it's a lot more, it's a little more collaborative you guys and and how you guys shaped me as a writer and as a person, and also a lot of healing poems, a lot of various pieces that are very grounding, that are taking that negative energy and it may start off kind of that way, but it'll come out very positive and so it's taking that emotion and reshaping it, and that's something I've had to really work through this spring and actually this past six months. It was really really hard and I was like, because I felt like I was a broken record, but I was like this is what I'm trying to say, but it's not coming out effectively.

Speaker 1:

Damn Damn. My trauma anxiety came out the fucker three volumes. My trauma came out for three volumes. I'm like fuck this shit. Like like the real, be honest with you and with my listeners. Like I have changed my book cover four times, four times, and you trying to, four times, four times and you try to choose the one that looks good and I think I did it. People are like, well, it would have been a snippet on my story. If people saw it, it would have been a snippet.

Speaker 3:

But choosing things in the book is hard yeah, well, the cover I am not like graphically artistic. So I had a friend, that um, who's very gifted in just drawing and stitching, and she's like I got three ideas for you and the one was like some japanese clouds, um. One was like she's like, hear me out now, how about like a collage of your face, but with pictures of you? And I'm like, do I that? No, absolutely not me at all. Like I am, I'm not Madonna, I do not want to look at myself every dime. You know. Like that, I was just like no, we're gonna stop this conversation. Then one day I was in new york city. I was at, um, there's like quite a few japanese bookstores and I was in one of them and I was waiting in line for the only bathroom and I'm in the middle of like kind of the sci-fi astrophysics section and I was like, oh and her, and I have a deep appreciation for astrophysics.

Speaker 3:

I was like I want stars and shit. And then she came back with like a colored sketch of like the night sky and a shooting star.

Speaker 2:

It was so good.

Speaker 3:

And all I had and Marcus helped me like scan that image onto it and it doesn't really go with any particular piece and that's what I think is so beautiful image onto it and it doesn't really go with any particular piece and that's what I think's so beautiful. It's just, it's a captivating image and it and it's something that you know, it can just speak to anyone in different levels and it's a unique, it's a very unique image and, um, I don't know what the next one's gonna be. Maybe I'm going to paint, I don't know. Probably I'll probably have a stick figure.

Speaker 1:

I think we are. I think, like me, you and definitely chris, I think we are definitely on this journey of writing the second book um the sea. First of all, the sea house. Like I said before, the sea house blossom.

Speaker 3:

Hey, he is full all of us like, uh, oh my gosh. Like cory, then, um, stephanie, especially, oh my god, talk about coming out of your shell. Like, um, you know, just, we've all. I, you know, I think what really helped is that we, uh, you know, we're supportive of each other and we go to each other's events. We're always trying to, you know, be there for each, and not just in the poetry world, but as friends, and that's made a tremendous difference on the, the impact. That's like the definition of what community is and that's what makes free verse. You know, um, yeah, it was created by one person, but it's really a collaboration of all of us.

Speaker 1:

Oh gosh, even looking at free verses now, it's so packed, yes, and it's hard to get on the mic now. It's hard to get on the mic now For me. I haven't been to a free verse in a long time and I'm like damn. I miss these shit. And it'd be like damn when you look at the list like damn.

Speaker 3:

It's a lot of people. There's other poets, a chance to go up. You get to experience a whole new, different vibe.

Speaker 3:

And get new pieces that you never thought about Like, oh, oh, like, okay, this is different. You know, what I love about poetry is like, okay, I'm gonna flash back to roger minewater and I'm sure it was something about lettuce at a grocery store and I'm like, who can do that's amazing. You're thinking about this guy looking at lettuce and grocery store and man, that guy loves something. You know, that's incredible, it's funny. But I'm like this it's cool.

Speaker 1:

Um, you know they're oh, and the way how people play on words. Oh my god, it is so dope and you'd be like damn, like how you got out of that one word.

Speaker 3:

You know. You know you're good when someone else comes up to you and be like I wish I wrote that and I'm like oh, okay, and back your head and be like damn like by the way, your poetry album that you released recently had me in tears.

Speaker 3:

I'm crying, like, first of all, it was dope as hell to be like, yeah, like to, to make a poetry album, you know. And I'm like, oh, I didn't really, I didn't really know. I mean, I know that was a thing, but I didn't, you know, but the way, the way you did, it was just so unique, because you, it wasn't just you, it was a collaboration of a few of us, and I was actually at rehearsals at dock street theater for the, the opera and poetry thing, and I was listening to it in the back queue and I was just like crying. So I'm like this was so beautiful, like the whole album was like I mean, I was crying, literally crying, and I was, I was like making actual art, you know.

Speaker 1:

Oh well, I can say this to my listeners and I will say this to you. So the second one I'm working on it's it's the way how, if I get the people I reach out to and they come back with a piece it is so gay. And the way how I collaborate, not only in my community. I reach out people who's in different states and they say they will. I say when I can't say his name, it's okay. When he send me his piece back, you want me to hop on this. I was like fuck my piece, like you want me to hop on this. I was like fuck my piece, like you want me to hop on this. And the fact that he's collaborating with um, oh my gosh, what is his name? What is his name? I forgot it was coming to me, I was probably going to say it later down the line, but he is collaborating with somebody that we know that he been on one of my pieces, the first, will Davies.

Speaker 1:

It is well, it is well, it is well, well, well, shout the world, because what will also be on my second album as well? Um him and another person who's going to hop on peace of mind it was incredible.

Speaker 3:

Like I you know as a writer, like there's so many times where people didn't take me serious because I don't just do poetry. Like I have a full writing service and I'm trying to sell to a non-creative audience that professional biographies matter.

Speaker 3:

Your image where words matter, like your story matters in your business, in your craft, and not just the content that you're displaying, and so trying to get people to understand that is a feat in and of itself. And I feel it's so weird to me that, like I've gotten more more um responses to collect on poetry than I have on the writing service. I'm like if I could get the writing service going, I won't have to worry about working in another job or you know, whatever I can do, more poetry things, um, so it's speaking in existence baby, I'm telling you are, you are fathered, and stuff other people no, and it's just like when I was in New York.

Speaker 3:

I literally and if you guys have ever been to New York, people in New York, even in Manhattan, if you live in Manhattan, they still pack a backpack because you're on the go constantly. So I would travel from the place I was staying, go into the city, I would network in the morning all different kinds of networking groups, business groups, whatever, whatever even if I felt like I did not belong, like I was there. Um, I even connected with somebody who worked at new york times, like I was on it, and then at the night I would connect with the poetry people, poetry community and it's exhausting, like so exhausting.

Speaker 3:

But what happened was, like you know, when I came back to charlest, those people became my new connections and my referrals, and it's so important Maybe you don't have to do it as strenuous as I did, but just or even going down to Savannah and connecting with those people down there or Charlotte or wherever, that is so important to you know, because poetry is still kind of an underground scene and it is, yeah I say it is because I feel like a lot of people don't take it as serious as they take other material serious, like poetry.

Speaker 1:

It's another way of hip-hop, pop, r&b. It's still on rock the road, it's still on that category side. Poetry is underground, but once you hear it and once you hear the playing words, the emotions, how to grab the attention of people and just the way how you say your pieces and the way how it comes off, people is magic, it's storytelling.

Speaker 3:

That's essentially what it is, you know, and there, you know, is people sharing their versions of themselves and then people connecting with that and they're like oh, they think exactly the way I think you know, good or bad.

Speaker 2:

True, True, true true.

Speaker 1:

So, abby, so how can I ask this question? May you give us poetry like spit, some poetry for us, us, or you know, just do a little something, something maybe one or two, you know just you know I'll do one.

Speaker 3:

I haven't really done that much. Men either F up with other women or F up as an upgrade to the one who takes them from rat race to foreign places. The one who counts opportunities, not coins, because she's on her journey to destiny, ready for a man who doesn't give in to pleasantries, simply puts her mind at ease with honesty. Both can chase their dreams still build structures and realistic beings. It's not about the size or the stuff. It's the he-she on the other side of the key that defines a chapter called Home in the story. Most men want to F up to the crown and still want to fool around, but the man who does him Sees the future within, breaks down. No more bullshit. Re then as the woman who, in return, fulfills him.

Speaker 1:

Oh my god I'm sorry I lost it.

Speaker 3:

Keep going girl listen, woman knows that eventually your absorbent amount of positivity can tilt to E. So please know, whatever amount you inject in me, I want to be the lady to recharge, check your tires and hold your keys. And even if you don't naturally grow together, you're still man and woman enough to accept, move on and still support each other, because that's how true growth grows, that's how love grows.

Speaker 1:

Deep in it. I was saying those who get it, get it. Okay, those who get it, get it. If you don't get it, replay it until you get it. So my last question for you and I'd like to ask all my guesters, after all you have been done and what you have did for your community, family and friends, and if today was your last day, what do Abby want to be known for that?

Speaker 3:

You got to lay that bomb Okay.

Speaker 2:

Okay, you gotta lay that bomb okay I, I would, I would hope.

Speaker 3:

My aspiration is that I made a very monumental impact for somebody out there, that I did enough, that you know I, despite whatever obstacles came my way, that it was enough for me to lay a foundation for something or someone else, and that you know that I had gave enough love, that it was well received.

Speaker 1:

But also just laid something down, left something behind, you know, valuable. Damn, that's dope. That's dope, that's true. I'd like to thank you so much for all you have done for me and leading the way of poetry and just getting up and doing you. So where can my listeners find you at? On social media. You know, shout yourself out. You know, shout your business that you were doing. Now I shout you out, girl.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, well, thank you again. I mean, you know it takes all of us to be successful, so not just me. But yeah, you can reach me at veranationcom. That's veranationcom. It'll go straight to my inbox in there. Instagram veranation girl or veranation writing either one.

Speaker 1:

That's pretty much it any final last words you want to say to my listeners take care of yourself, be kind to yourself and each other.

Speaker 3:

But be kind to you, be patient with yourself, no matter what you're going through. It's a temporary phase, because what you reflect about yourself goes on other people you know, um, so just take some time for yourself, because the less time you take time for yourself, like you're going to realize what happened and you know you're doing too much for other people. But be kind to yourself and be kind to others.

Speaker 1:

That's dope and that note. We're going to leave it at that point. Thank you, Abby, for joining me on Just the Two of Us. Like I said, it's your boy, Mr Zach, on his watch at two, and see y'all motherfucking later.